January 27th, 2006 | 
Author: 
asked:
Did they go into Israel and steal the Hebrew scrolls or something? How did European Christians who weren’t Jewish get the Old Testament? Before anyone says Jesus was a Jew. If Jesus was a Jew then why don’t modern Jews agree with Christians?
Coral Bellantone
Did they go into Israel and steal the Hebrew scrolls or something? How did European Christians who weren’t Jewish get the Old Testament? Before anyone says Jesus was a Jew. If Jesus was a Jew then why don’t modern Jews agree with Christians?
Coral Bellantone
Posted in Religion & Spirituality | 
Tags: European Christians, Hebrew Book, Hebrew Scrolls, Israel, Jesus Was A Jew, Jews, Old Testament
I don’t think it was called the Old Testament then. I think it was called the Scriptures…which means the writings. There weren’t any Christians at that point. I think it would be like if a group of Christians who already have the Bible took it as their own but said it had been fulfilled…and that they’re starting from scratch again. But there would be the others who said…no it hasn’t been fulfilled…we’re still waiting for the Messiah. Considering the printing press hadn’t been invented yet…I don’t see how more than a handful of people had access to the writings anyway.
Because it was Jesus who wrote the Mosaic Laws in the Old Testament that He later added His moral teachings to when He came to Earth in human form who’s followers evolved into Christians.
***…belonged to Jews?***
Jesus was Jewish. All the disciples were Jewish. All those in Jerusalem in the upper room on Pentecost were Jewish. Christ is the Greek word for Messiah. Like you said, no one went into Israel and stole the Hebrew scrolls Christianity and Judaism was identical until God personally raised Jesus from the dead.
***If Jesus was a Jew then why don’t modern Jews agree with Christians?***
What, you think modern Judaism and the Judaism on the Hebrew scrolls is the same?
Where is the Temple with the Mercy Seat where God sits?
Where is the alter, sacrifice or priest in the line of Aaron? Even if there was a Temple, Modern Judaism can’t produce a priest in the line of Aaron according to Ezra 2.
Who could be the Jewish Messiah? Modern Judaism can’t produce a messiah in the line of David as no one can prove their lineage.
The God of the scrolls could speak and lead His people. Modern Judaism’s god does not. Should a rabbi say, “I heard the voice of God.” he would be discredited by his congregation.
As cat’s meow, expert in Judaism since birth, said,
***Atheism doesn’t, strange as it may sound, violate Judaism; there are Jewish Atheists. As Atheism doesn’t involve worshipping idols or other deities, and as Atheists can and do enjoy and respect the complex ethical structure within Judaism, there’s not the conflict that one might expect to find.***
As Atheists would have problems with monotheism and the scriptures, for Jews not to have Jewish Atheists means to be a Jew, one doesn’t have to believe in God or the scriptures to be a modern Jew.
This is why Jews don’t agree with Christians.
Like Moses, the Messiah was born when Israelites were slaves. Herod’s Temple, named for the Roman Govenor, was where Jews went to worship.
After no Jew could remember being free from Rome, the Jews revolted without inquiring God as they used to do when the Tanach was written. As the Tanach would predict, the God-less revolt failed. Herod’s Temple was destroyed, many men died, many women ***** and many infants were born.
The Talmud was compiled as a result of a God-less revolt. No one claims that God inspired anyone to write or compile or cannonize this book.
Therefore, the Talmud and the Tanach are completely different. The Talmud is atheistic from origin to cannonization. It was from the smoldering ashes of the Temple and the babies cries for their fathers that that Talmud was compiled.
Contrast the above with the New Covenant:
Hebrews 9:***11When Christ came as high priest of the good things that are already here,[b] he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not man-made, that is to say, not a part of this creation. 12He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, having obtained eternal redemption. 13The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean. 14How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death,[c] so that we may serve the living God!
15For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.
16In the case of a will,[d] it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, 17because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while the one who made it is living. 18This is why even the first covenant was not put into effect without blood. 19When Moses had proclaimed every commandment of the law to all the people, he took the blood of calves, together with water, scarlet wool and branches of hyssop, and sprinkled the scroll and all the people. 20He said, “This is the blood of the covenant, which God has commanded you to keep.”[e] 21In the same way, he sprinkled with the blood both the tabernacle and everything used in its ceremonies. 22In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.
23It was necessary, then, for the copies of the heavenly things to be purified with these sacrifices, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24For Christ did not enter a man-made sanctuary that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God’s presence. 25Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.***
;&version=31;
The New Covenent was written like every other covenent…It was written after God’s revelation.
If modern Jews agreed with Christianty’s basic premises:
1. Monotheism
2. The inspiration and authority of the scriptures by God
then Jews would believe in Jesus. As they have Atheist Jews, it is a matter of the Jews leaving their faith.
As the Tanach says,
Nehemiah 9***26Nevertheless they were disobedient, and rebelled against Thee, and cast Thy law behind their back, and slew Thy prophets that did forewarn them to turn them back unto Thee, and they wrought great provocations. 27 Therefore Thou didst deliver them into the hand of their adversaries, who distressed them;
Hope this helps
Very simply put, Christianity is like a religion “continuing” Judaism in the sense that the first Christians (like Jesus and his apostels who didn’t call themselves that) were all Jews that believed the prophecy had been fulfilled and the Messiah had walked the earth. There were other Jews, on the other hand, who did not believe Jesus is the messiah since it conflicts with what the original scripture says.
So there you can kind of say Judaism split – some Jews stayed as they were and remained Jewish to this day, and some Jews went ahead and wrote an addition to the bible (the New Testament), started calling themselves Christians and went on to spread their word and try and convert the rest of the world to their new religion as well (which is against Judaism, the only monotheistic religion that isn’t missionary).
That’s why both religions believe in the Old Testament and Jews do not believe Jesus was the messiah even though he was Jewish.
Many Jews were converted to Christianity and for a while it was thought to be a Christian you should first have been a Jew as was Jesus!
Most of what DSM says is incorrect. I don’t have time to deal with his misinterpretation of just about everything he says about Judaism in his response, I will leave that to those with more patience. I am just going to respond to his statement that there are no Jewish priests to be found,. The DNA has proved there are priests descended from the line of Aaron. We have Cohanim, descendants of Aaron who give a priestly blessing on Yom Kippur and read certain sections of the Torah.Here’s more on the study
Dr. Karl Skorecki, a Cohen of Eastern European parents, was attending synagogue one morning. The Cohen called up for the Torah reading that morning was a Jew of Sephardic background, whose parents were born in North Africa.Dr. Skorecki looked at the Sephardi Cohen’s physical features and considered his own physical features.They were significantly different in stature, skin coloration and hair and eye color. Yet both had a tradition of being Cohanim, direct descendants of one man — Aaron, the brother of Moses.
Cohanim (plural of Cohen) are the priestly family of the Jewish people, members of the Tribe of Levi.The books of Exodus and Leviticus describe the responsibilities of the Cohanim, which include the Temple service and blessing of the people. The Torah (the first five books of the Bible) describes the anointing of Aaron, the brother of Moses, as the first High Priest (Cohen Gadol).
Jewish tradition, based on the Torah, is that all Cohanim are direct descendants of Aaron, the brother of Moses. The Cohen line is patrilineal — passed from father to son without interruption for 3,300 years, or more than 100 generations.
The Cohen line is patrilineal — passed from father to son without interruption for 3,300 years.
Dr. Skorecki considered, “According to tradition, this Sephardi Cohen and I have a common ancestor. Could this line have been maintained since Sinai, and throughout the long exile of the Jewish people?” As a scientist, he wondered, could such a claim be tested?
Being a nephrologist and a top-level researcher at the University of Toronto and the Rambam-Technion Medical Center in Haifa, he was involved in the breakthroughs in molecular genetics which are revolutionizing medicine and the study of the life-sciences. He was also aware of the newly developing application of DNA analysis to the study of history and population diversity.
Dr. Skorecki considered a hypothesis: if the Cohanim are descendants of one man, they should have a common set of genetic markers — a common haplotype — that of their common ancestor. In our case, Aaron HaCohen.
HOW IT WORKS
A genetic marker is a variation in the nucleotide sequence of the DNA, known as a mutation. Mutations which occur within genes — a part of the DNA which codes for a protein — usually cause a malfunction or disease and is lost due to selection in succeeding generations. However, mutations found in so-called “non-coding regions” of the DNA tend to persist.
Since the Y chromosome consists almost entirely of non-coding DNA (except for the genes determining maleness), it would tend to accumulate mutations. Since it is passed from father to son without recombination, the genetic information on a Y chromosome of a man living today is basically the same as that of his ancient male ancestors, except for the rare mutations that occur along the hereditary line.
A combination of these neutral mutations, known as a haplotype, can serve as a genetic signature of a man’s male ancestry. Maternal genealogies are also being studied by means of the m-DNA (mitrocondrial DNA), which is inherited only from the mother.
THE SEARCH BEGINS
Dr. Skorecki made contact with Professor Michael Hammer, of the University of Arizona, a leading researcher in molecular genetics and a pioneer in Y chromosome research. Professor Hammer uses DNA analysis to study the history of populations, their origins and migrations. His previous research included work on the origins of the Native American Indians and the development of the Japanese people.
A study was undertaken to test the hypothesis. If there were a common ancestor, the Cohanim should have common genetic markers at a higher frequency than the general Jewish population.
In the first study, as reported in the prestigious British science journal, Nature (January 2, 1997), 188 Jewish males were asked to contribute some cheek cells from which their DNA was extracted for study. Participants from Israel, England and North America were asked to identify whether they were a Cohen, Levi or Israelite, and to identify their family background.
The results of the analysis of the Y chromosome markers of the Cohanim and non-Cohanim were indeed significant. A particular marker, (YAP-) was detected in 98.5 percent of the Cohanim, and in a significantly lower percentage of non-Cohanim.
FURTHER CONFIRMATION
In a second study, Dr. Skorecki and associates gathered more DNA samples and expanded their selection of Y chromosome markers. Solidifying their hypothesis of the Cohens’ common ancestor, they found that a particular array of six chromosomal markers was found in 97 of the 106 Cohens tested. This collection of markers has come to be known as the Cohen Modal Hapoltype (C